cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/29579005
An open source project the size of Lemmy needs constant work to manage the project, implement new features and fix bugs. Dessalines and I work full-time on these tasks and more. As there is no advertising or tracking, all of our work is funded through donations. Unfortunately the amount of donations has decreased to only 2000€ per month. This leaves only 1000€ per developer, which is not enough to pay my bills. With the current level of donations I will be forced to find another job, and drastically reduce my contributions to Lemmy. To avoid this outcome and keep Lemmy growing, I ask you to please make a recurring donation:
Liberapay | Ko-fi | Patreon | OpenCollective | Crypto
If you want more information before donating, consider the comparison with Reddit. It began as startup funded by rich investors. The site is managed by corporate executives who over time have become more and more disconnected from normal users. Their main goal is to make investors happy and to make a profit. This leads to user-hostile decisions like firing the employee responsible for AMAs, blocking third-party apps and more. As Reddit is a single website under a single authority, it means all users need to follow the same rules, including ridiculous ones like censoring the name “Luigi”.
Lemmy represents a new type of social media which is the complete opposite of Reddit. It is split across many different websites, each with its own rules, and managed by normal people who actually care about the users. There is no company and no profit motive. Much of the work is carried out by volunteer admins, mods and posters, who contribute out of enthusiasm and not for money. For users this is great as there is no advertising nor tracking, and no chance of takeover by a billionaire. Additionally there are no builtin political or ideological restrictions. You can use the software for any purpose you like, add your own restrictions or scrutinize its inner workings. Lemmy truly belongs to everyone.
Dessalines and I work fulltime on Lemmy to keep up with all the feature requests, bug reports and development work. Even so there is barely enough time in the day, and no time for a second job. Previously I sometimes had to rely on my personal savings to keep developing Lemmy for you, but that can’t go on forever. We partly rely on NLnet for funding, but they only pay for development of new features, and not for mandatory maintenance work. The only available option are user donations. To keep it viable donations need to reach a minimum of 5000€ per month, resulting in a modest salary of 2500€ per developer. If that goal is reached Dessalines and I can stop worrying about money, and fully focus on improving the software for the benefit of all users and instances. Please use the link below to see current donation stats and make your contribution! We especially rely on recurring donations to secure the long-term development and make Lemmy the best it can be.
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So many “I hate tankies” that now I’m afraid the project will die. But if those tankies have a change of heart and decide to make Lemmy for profit we will see Reddit history all over again.
2500 eur is a very low wage to live on considering the importance of this project. To be honest, the Lemmy community should be deeply thankful that the devs are “tankies“, otherwise Lemmy would be just another reddit tragedy to happen.
(And keeping .ml up costs almost nothing, their users can maintain it easily, the devs wages needs funding)
I personally find it kind of hard to support tankies
Do I really want to fund lemmyml? This whole thing puts the community in a weird position.
Yeah, i totally get it. I wish they would separate the instance funding from the dev funding, I think that would help with a clearer structure and less objections.
lemmy.ml hosting is exclusively paid via Opencollective. This means all other donation options go directly to developer salaries.
I will not donate to help .ml
I totally agree with you
If they want my money there needs to be some sort of non profit structure that keeps track of the money in a public way. It is hard to know where the money is actually going. I also do not want to support lemmyml in any way even if it is a development instance. If they wanted my support they shouldn’t of banned people for not holding crazy ideologies. I can not support them and it wrong for them to try guilt trip the community into giving them money. There is no way to know where it is going and why. If they can no longer support Lemmy do to financial reasons that’s fine. Lemmy is a community project and has plenty of people to work on it.
I would definitely like to setup a foundation to handle the finances for Lemmy. But doing that requires a significant amount of time and money, which we do not have yet. Also lemmy.ml hosting is exclusively paid via Opencollective, all other donation options go directly to developer salaries.
If you set up a foundation with a board composed of unbiased individuals I would support you in heart beat.
The problem I have is supporting two individuals who potentially have an political agenda. I get that Lemmy is ultimately your project but it would make me feel better having it controlled by the community. I don’t mind you making a salary but I think there needs to be some sort of accountability.
Creating a foundation requires a significant amount of time and effort, and also results in extra overhead for regular tax declarations and other management. I dont think its feasible at this time, but definitely something I want to do in the future.
Thanks for the response
You realize that .ml is also the development instance used by the devs? Where they test features, fix issues, and so forth before rolling it out to lemmy as a whole?
The costs of running .ml are also miniscule compared to the cost of living two full time working people require, I read in another comment it is only like 30 bucks a month for the instance.
I also find it a little silly that people love lemmy but hate on .ml. Lemmy is the brainchild of two far leftists, made with leftist concepts and goals in mind. You can’t separate those two things…
“Love your work, but fuck you and your beliefs I won’t support that. Also please continue work on the free product I like”.
*disclaimer: I’m just as russo- and sinophobe as the next guy. Fuck them, their dystopian countries and values. I just don’t really care the people making lemmy might not entirely (lol) agree with that.
Eh. I also don’t like the countries and values. But I’ve always taken “Russophobe” and “Sinophobe” to mean “no matter your personal beliefs, if you have Russian or Chinese heritage you are a bad person and worth less than other human beings” and I have big problems with that. Is that not the actual definition of those words? Am I wrong?
Love your work, but fuck you and your beliefs I won’t support that
I did it with Lost Prophets I can do it with Lemmy
Lemmy is just software. There is no politics in code or math. Anything extra is just tacked on because it is convenient.
The whole concept of federation is political in itself.
If I’m being honest that seems pretty silly to me. That’s like saying water is political. It can be political if you want it to be political. You remind me of a guy I say in some Linux forums talking about how Linux is going to to bring the techno-anarchist revolution we all want. He was shocked that no one seemed to agree with his views. I’m not saying your views are wrong but to think a protocol/concept exists purely to support your views is a bit of a stretch. I think you have a right to hold whatever political view you want but please don’t go around calling federation inherently political.
I’m not saying AP/federation exists “purely” to fit my views, that’s absurd.
I’m saying that the concept of a decentralized protocol with the objective of letting various individual domains interact instead of a single corporate or government controlled entity is, objectively, a political goal. Power to the people. Censorship protection. Astroturfing safeguards.
How is this in your opinion not inherently a political system? Besides, almost everything is a political act nowadays. Even the belief that nothing is political is also political.
Just donated. Quick question, what does donating lemmy.org do different than donating directly to your instance?
just to be clear, lemmy.org has nothing to do with this post. This post is about support the developer of lemmy, so the lemmy software. The instance the developer are running is lemmy.ml.
Lemmy.org is just another instance that has nothing to do with the developement. If you donate to lemmy.zip is just for maintaining this instance.
So if you donate to links in this post, you support the developement of lemmy, there are 2-3 developer currently.
Oh so I donated to the page linked here so I donated to a developer that runs the software or lemmy.ml?
I feel so slow right now. I apologize in advance. Lol
You donated to the devs working full time with no pay developing the lemmy software that all instances run.
lemmy.ml is the instance used by the devs to test changes under real world conditions, so running that instance is funded by the same donations.For comparison:
The devs need $5000/month total, to keep developing lemmy full time.
Running lemmy.ml costs $30/month.You donated to the devs working full time with no pay developing the lemmy software
They receive grants from foundations like NLnet occasionally, so it isn’t as if they’re completely unpaid aside from individual donations.
https://join-lemmy.org/news/2024-09-11_-_New_NLnet_funding_for_Lemmy
Except that’s only for features and not for maintenance, security, or development work that doesn’t receive grants.
Okay great, thank you!
You donation goes mainly in the developement of lemmy.
Counterpoint
It’s a tough balance to strike. On the one hand, not everyone will have their political beliefs align with the Lemmy devs, so donating to them feels like betraying your own morals and values. On the other hand, they’re pretty much the only ones keeping Lemmy going (in terms of active development, at least), so it makes sense that they need some sort of revenue to keep things afloat for everyone else.
Donating to the instance admins is awesome since users are more likely to interact with those than with the OG devs but even that only helps so much. Speaking as a user first and foremost, I can’t afford paying more than what I already am for our instance to stay alive since I’m a broke student. However, donating to the “real” devs is just as important, and if you do have the money, it’s worth a consideration at least, I’d wager.
My two cents. Obligatory “fuck tankies”
TBH, if donating to the devs feels like betraying your morals and values, using the project should feel wrong as well.
